Rumsfeld is stepping down, South Dakota voted down an abortion ban, and the Dems took back the house. What else can blow my mind or make my day?
Well, this for one. I think its pretty hilarious actually. Protestors in Budapest have been receiving international shows of solidarity from none other than Italian footballers. Images like this are creeping up all over the place. "Avanti Ragazzi" means, literally, "Forward, boys and girls." The whole phrase can be roughly translated from Italian "Onward, fellows of Budapest!" Its a reference to a song that was written about the 1956 revolution by the same name.
Avanti ragazzi di Buda avanti ragazzi di Pest studenti, braccianti, operai, il sole non sorge più ad Est.
Neato. Now if only I had a clue who this Robert Gates guy is.
Can I just say, that the people at index.hu and the reports that they come up with are mind-blowing. There is no media ANYWHERE in the states that has coverage like this. I am just speechless and filled with joy.
This walk-through was put together by the lovely folks at index.hu. You will recognize some of the pics from the earlier post. There are a few points where their narrative differs from ours. We're sticking to our story, with confidence that most versions of Mondays events are probably equally true.
Thanks to riotsinhungary.blog.hu for making this HTML available.
21:00 - 24:00 Blaha Lujza téri, Ferenciek tere, Erzsébet híd
There are fewer and fewer people on Blaha Lujza tér. On Ferenciek tere, at the Pest side of the Erzsébet bridge however, protesters build a massive barricade using materials taken from a nearby construction yard.
My friends and I ended up right in the middle of the crowd by accident...By the time I reached the upper floor of the Deak Ferenc Ter I could see the smoke, it was a tear gas granade, thrown or shot by the police. It went all the way down into the underground territory. People were running around, some stood shocked, some were scared, but most of them were not prepared to be in such a situation. When I rushed out to the street I ended up in a cloud of tear gas, which was shot by the police every 20 to 30 seconds into the crowd. I saw the old Soviet truck being pushed towards the riot police, I saw how the protestants [sic] started the old Soviet tank and tried to guide it through the crowd, but I saw no barricades there. I saw no extremists, skinheads or fascists. As a matter of fact, the more I was moving away from the epicentre the more surprised I was. It almost looked like the crowd wanted to have a regular demonstration and the government didn't want that to happen. People around me were in their 30's and 40's. I saw a large group of old people, in their 60's and 70's. What really surprised me was the riot police...I saw the police officer on horse hitting a woman right in front of me. Her only fault was that she was not fast enough to turn away from a galloping horse. This happened about 150 meters away from the epicentre, where the riot police were standing in line. I saw police officers beating the crap out of anyone they can catch and drag behind their lines. And I was extremely surprised to hear that the police acted professional and legitimate. Throwing tear gas into the subway underground territory is extremely dangerous and unjustifiable. Riding over protestants [sic] with horses is hard to justify as well. But then again, maybe I am just overreacting. After all, I don't know all the truth about the people who were surrounding me in the crowd, except for their age and their appearance (seemed like regular Hungarians to me). After all, maybe the police did act professionally and it's a new European police tactic of breaking up the crowd with rubber bullets, water, gas and horses. After all, maybe right wing extremists are young people, elderly and middle aged regular Hungarian protestants [sic].
Strange things are happening...Halfyear ago, in Vladivostok, a police officer hit a woman in front of TV camera and was immediately fired. Until now I didn't hear about any policemen arrested for his actions against innocent people.
Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 7:04 pm Post subject: Budapest is Politicaly Hot....
As a Political Scientist it a very interesting thing to observe. as an American I feel like Hungary has something in common with the United States Independence. May-be there should be somthing the people can better identify with like parades, fireworks, a day off from school and work...I'm very happy for Hungary. Not to long ago Americans were not aloud behind the iron curtain. now here I am that says allot. ...You see, Hungary is a very politicaly opressed country, it has been ruled by so many for the past two thousand years. its a political phenomena we can observe first hand. its a very beutiful thing.
Ok, so I still stand to be convinced that the last guy on the thread is an American (hello syntax), or even a sensible human being. I understand the draw towards witnessing and recording political events like these, but its a little sickly to call police violence and mass rioting a "beautiful thing". I cant recall the last time I say someone get their face ground to a pulp and then commented on the beautiful interpersonal harmony that is forged from violent social behavior control. I dunno. I'm glad these threads are anonymous, cause this guy is just asking for a smack down.
Also, I have to add that I too am surprised that the police violence isn't really being responded to. Even if there is no official response to officers acting out of line, there is usally a public outcry.
Where are the crowds of people shouting "Rodney King!" over and over? Aren't they supposed to be here?
Well, at least teh politicos are still getting each others panties in a wad. This article was posted by Caboodle.hu
Parliament rejects session to discuss Budapest riots By: HATC 2006-10-25 09:42:00
Parliament's House Committee yesterday dismissed appeals for a special session to discuss the previous day's riots in Budapest.
Prime Minister Ferenc Gyurcsány spoke about the events in a speech before the day's main business, though Fidesz and Christian Democrat MPs left the chamber in line with their boycotting policy.
Gyurcsány said: "those who sought to hurt me have taken their revenge on the nation. Demonstration is rightful but we will not tolerate riots and I expect the police to fight against them with all their might," he added. "They do not understand what they are playing with," continued Gyurcsány, turning to the empty Fidesz seats. "This situation was brought about by a politician who does not respect God, nor human and constitutional democracy," he declared.
Parliamentary regulations require debates to be declared 14-28 days in advance. Fidesz and the Christian Democrats dropped their plan to hold a debate on the riots because of these requirements and will instead raise questions at official meetings of the law enforcement, human rights and national security House committees.
"This extraordinary situation arose because a police attack was ordered on the opposition's demonstration," said Fidesz caucus leader Tibor Navracsics.
Free Democrat chairman Gábor Kuncze retorted: "We have reached new heights of political idiocy, hearing that the police provoked peaceful demonstrators, who were equipped with metal balls and molotov cocktails under Árpád flags." The red and white striped Árpád flags were also used by the Hungary's Nazi Arrow Cross movement.
"The original offence was Gyurcsány offending the nation, but Orbán's reckless behaviour is also leading the country to anarchy," said Democratic Forum leader Ibolya Dávid. "Both should resign," she concluded.
For the record, my impression is that the people who were waiving the red and white flags had more to do with the Greater Hungary cause than an anti-semitic one, but I can't really back that up. I mean, I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin...
I must also refer you to the Riots in Hungary blog and Pestiside.hu, which have fabulous records of tactics and narratives of the event. They are full of great commentary, pics, and videos.
In September, Gyurcsani, the prime minister of Hungary, was caught on audio tape admitting at a socialist dinner event that he had lied extensively, and not just lied, but partook of the made-lots-of-stuff-up-on-the-spot type of lying, to the Hungarian public about the state of the economy in order to win the national elections in April. He also admitted to his administration generally "fucking up" the government and state management for the past 4 years.
The next day, protestors stormed the Hungarian TV station. The crowd wanted to read a call for Gyurcsani's resignation on the air. They were held back by police, and the conflict dissolved into full scale rioting that lasted through the night.
Some very interesting videos have been creeping up concerning the demonstrations against the Gyurcsani administration from September. These are a choice few:
Below is video from the rioting on October 23. The logistics of the protests are explained below, but watch for the following things in these videos:
*Normal People: This all began when the police began teargassing a crowd that consisted of everyday folk, people who brought their kids and dogs, who had gathered for a peaceful march in commemoration of the 1956 revolution. Fueled by police violence and antagonism, many of these average citizens with no political issue began to take up arms against police.
*Police Brutality: So, its pretty hard to miss. But the actions of the police observed first hand at these events include: Firing tear gas canisters full force, horizontally into crowds, firing rubber bullets at close range, throwing cobble stones into the crowd, beating and clubbing unarmed civilians with out provocation, and generally, inciting most of the violence by antagonizing the crowds in an extreme way. The crowd at my university has seen their fair share of protests and everyone agrees that the police were unreasonably brutal, often straight out vicious.
*Hungarian flags with holes in the middle: Before the 56 revolution, the Hungarian flag had a communist star in the center. Hungarians cut this star out of all the flags when the communists were [nominally] expelled.
*Red and white striped flags: This is the flag of the pro-nazi party from 1956. The presence and number of these flags at the riots yesterday are causing many Hungarians to write the whole event off as the work of some scum bag, nazi hooligans. As I have been talking to people, I have found that this is exclusively the opinion of people who were not actually there on the day.
*Fascists and FIDESZ members: Folks carrying those red and white striped flags. They threw a whole lot of rocks and molotov cocktails all night long. They also are responsible for the tank incident, which has been described on other mainstream websites as "the glory moment"
*The crowd screaming "AVH": These are the initials of the Államvédelmi Hatóság, or the Hungarian secret police, under the Soviet regime. They were known to have brutally killed many citizens, and kept political prisoners in concentration camps
Oh, and the tank. So the tank was on display in front of a huge hungarian flag (with a hole in the middle) in downtown Budapest. It is a soviet model from the 50s. A few members of the opposition party (as I said, more explaination below) broke into the tank, and began driving it towards the brigade of riot police. Marko, Stephen and Wyatt were standing on it when it started moving. That video follows the clip of the tank moving through the crowd.
Some of these videos were ripped from TV and news sites. Some, we recorded ourselves.
video collection from index.hu THIS ONE IS NOT TO BE MISSED!:
At Erszebet Ter. Video taken by Wyatt:
At Nyugati Ter:
At Deak Ferenc Ter, from Index.hu:
From atop the same tank. Video taken by Wyatt:
At Deak Ferenc Ter:
Taken from Pestiside.hu
There is certainly a proto-anarchist movement of some sort at work (I used the term "movement" loosely here) that desires violence, either for political ends, or simple entertainment. This, however, describes only a handful of those opposed to the government, either in the crowd or in Hungary as a whole. At the same time, the Hungarian public's confidence in the police's ability or willingness to maintain order and behave responsibly is in free-fall, and comparisons to the communist-era security forces are becoming more common and louder every day.
Even giving police the benefit of the doubt, what I saw suggests incompetence and poor training; using teargas to drive a small group of violent protestors into the remnants of an official opposition rally certainly does not seem wise. (Employing teargas in a strong headwind is also counter-productive.) Meanwhile, given my experience I can't help but take seriously the disturbing rumors that individuals arrested in the previous round of rioting have been imprisoned without any proof that they were involved in instigating violence.
For sure, in a democracy - and despite the histrionics of some in the opposition, Hungary is a democracy - there is no room for violence of the sort desired by the small number of those who came out yesterday hoping for exactly what happened. But when the state deploys overwhelming force against a crowd that seeks nothing more than to make itself seen and heard, violence becomes inevitable. In particular, there was no legitimate reason for the government to decide that average Hungarians could not be seen and heard within kilometers of their own Parliament, especially as some of these same people had risked their lives or freedom protecting this same building, or working to return it to the function it was designed for.
Narrative:
This account of the riots on Monday are based on personal accounts and other eye witness accounts. Wyatt, Stephen, Jen and Marko were in Deak Ter as the violence began, in different locations, some of us central, some to the east. Marko, Luc, and Jen were with the crowd near the front lines at Astoria and on Blaha Lujza. Stefan was with the crowd locked in at Astoria. Marko also returned to Erszebet Hid late in the night. Heavy television and media coverage was also consulted.
From what we have been able to gather, this is how things went down. On Sunday, several opposition party protestors, FIDESZ, a Christian Democratic nationalist party, who very much want Gyorcsani anywhere but in the PM seat (ideally, they want him on a stick, but out of the government is enough for the moment), had a minor skirmish with police at Kossuth Ter, near the parliament. Because of this, the police closed the square. According to several accounts, opposition protestors tried to enter Kossuth Ter again on Monday, but were pushed south by the police into Deak Ferenc Ter, where another, larger group of nearly 100,000 were gathering for a planned march down Andrassy Utca. The video above that is labeled "Nyugati Ter" was taken only a few blocks east of parliament on the körút, or ring road, that connects to Andrassy to the South East. The police began to enter Deak Ferenc Ter from the north (above), walking along Bajcsy Zsilinszky Utca from Nyugati, and also from Andrassy Utca, from the east, where the citizens march was supposed to head. This was a peaceful citizens group, who were all surprised by the sudden police presence. There were several protesters, allegedly pushed back from Kossuth Ter, who were causing problems in Deak Ter. With out warning, the police began shooting paint into the crowd, followed quickly by teargas. So much tear gas was released, that the fumes were visible and the air was painful to breath nearly 1km away. The crowd started setting up barricades against the police. They drug large letters from a display in the square, and spelled the word "szabadsag", which is Hungarian for "freedom" in the middle of the road, reinforcing it with fencing, wood, and benches from the nearby area. The police started pushing the crowd south onto Karoly Korut. Part of Deak Ferenc Ter was being repaved. Cobble stones were stacked along one of the metro entrances. Opposition party members began breaking the cobblestones and hurling them at the police. Other people in the crowd started making a massive wreckpile in the middle of the road, in an attempt to prevent the police trucks from moving any further south. I want to emphasize that this was NOT made entirely by opposition protestors. Then the tank started moving. Opposition party protestors broke in and started the engine. They drove it into the road and turned it north, heading towards the riot police. Most people were incredulous, and could not understand the police's behavior. The video above looks like total mayhem, but from the ground, people were getting out of the way while hollaring and cheering for the tank. People were doubling over laughing on the side walks. Horns and wistles blew in support. The tear gas got thicker. The police started firing rubber bullets. Then, the police started pushing the crowd even further south. The crowd got backed up at Astoria, On Karoly Utca and Kossuth Lajos Utca. More barricades were set up against the approaching police. Tear gas continued to be fired on the crowd in massive quantities. The crowd began moving east towards Blaha Lujza Ter. The police entered from a side road from the north, and separated the two groups of protestors, leaving the largest group at Astoria on the west. The area was fenced, and the protestors on the west continued to receive the unending streams of tear gas fire. We saw the police shooting the tear gas cannisters straight into the crowd, hitting several people. This is where others report seeing the police throwing cobble stones back at the crowd. The police then turned on high power hoses, and turned these towards the less dense crowd of protestors on the Blaha Lujza side of the divided mass. Several windows of buildings were shattered as the jet of water turned 90 degrees to the left to be directed at the crowd. The police continued to push the largest mass of protestors down Kossuth Lajos towards Erszebet Hid, the bridge just to the south of Lanchid, the chain bridge. This group began building bigger barricades against the police. Tear gas kept being fired on the crowd. As the police antagonism kept on unabated people began chunking more cobblestones from behind the barricade. This continued on until very late in the night. This whole ordeal began at around 4pm. This is what the crowd pushed on to Erszebet Hid looked like at midnight. and elsewhere: To the best of our understanding, the crowd was held back for a very long time. The numbers slowly dissipated as the night progressed into the morning hours. The last of the crowd dispersed as the police rammed the makeshift barricade with a city snow plow. There are few reports of any violent action at parliament, further up Andrassy, or along the ring road, though thick fumes and tear gas cannisters indicate that riot police used violent crowd control tactics in these areas as well.
It should also be noted that, as the night progressed, many people who we feel comfortable grouping into the "average citizens" category started leaving, while stronger instigators stayed to continue clashing with the police. While the above narrative is meant to paint a picture of the reprehensible antagonism and violence on the part of the Budapest police, a great deal of violent and destructive behavior was seen from an ever growing crowd of opposition protestors, facist groups, and pro-nazi party supporters. Above all, it is important to note both the size and the diversity of the crowd.
Location: Ukrainian Village, Chicago, Illinois, United States
I am addicted to donuts.
I love running around after dark.
I am a beer snob and a vodka nerd.
I change my hair color alot.
Sometimes junior highers make more sense to me than anyone else in the world.
I am really good at finding neat things in dumpsters.
I can fix your bike for you.
I people watch.
I keep plants.
Whatever I am doing, I would rather be in the water.
